@ shy angel: i wish you lived where i do, and i wish that i lived where you do.

I wear rainbow socks to work.
i have a rainbow ring with 'PRIDE' engraved on it.
i have rainbows on my keyrings.
I have rainbow laces on my boots.

I wear all of this to work,
and no one has ever asked me if i'm gay.
No-one cares.
New Zealand is awesome.

I hope that one day you find a place as accepting as i did.

And because i love drama, i wish i could be out in your small town
I love a fight for a good cause!

Good luck, and hugs!

R

_________________
“All I feel is sunlight. All I hear is music.” Willow
How i Met Your Mother - By Ariel

My Story: Coming Home

Azirahael - Thank you
I want to move to another country where people are more tolerant and open-minded. I'm thinking about moving to UK. I'm going to finish college next year so after I do that, I can move. I lived in UK few years ago, but I came back home. That was big mistake. I was happy in UK ( I lived in Scotland ), I didn't have to hide. Hopefully my plan will work.

Hi Shy!

All my best wishes are being sent your way!

Keep in mind, a country, even a small one, is a big place.
You may not even have to move that far.
Just: anywhere that's not your home town, may be better.

I'm sure there are good and bad places for prejudice in every country.

But whatever happens, you have my (albeit limited) support!

Good luck!

R

_________________
“All I feel is sunlight. All I hear is music.” Willow
How i Met Your Mother - By Ariel

My Story: Coming Home

So hi?
Yeah, my coming out was a mixed and slightly strange affair.

Simply summed up as "I kissed a girl and I liked it." Yeah me and a group of friends were playing spin the bottle at a party and I kissed one of my closest friends. The thing that hit me most was that I always noticed other women like "I wish I had her figure" or "I want that clear skin" or some such, so the liking of the kiss as much as I did with the guys, if not more was a shocker and a half.

First was the denial, being from a small town where they few members of the LBGT community were bullied constantly, it kinda made sense not to come out as a lesbians or a bisexual or pan or whatever. So eventually I sucked up my fears and talked through MSN to one of my best friends who I consider as a brother and told him what I was feeling, how I was conflicted, and his response? "Whatever turns you on."

Granted, not the best advice, but it did help me clear my head a little and see that I was/am bi.

So yeah, I came out to him. But that was easy, I rarely see him. The problem would be the small town folk I call my friends, the ones I see and have known me to play around the field - guy-field.

Me being so insecure about my new knowledge of my sexuality, couldn't tell anyone in person, and the last person I would ever tell would be my family. They are insanely homophobic and are one of those people that would protest at gay pride. If I came out to them, it would affect my confidence (or lack of) and would not be pretty at all.

So I told my best friend through MSN as I couldn't do it in person, a few months after I discovered myself and she was proud of me and told me she loved me, no matter what. I really do love that girl.

So I got confidence from that and told each member of my inner social group once by one for a while and the responses were all the same. Shocked? Well I was to begin with, but you get the douchbags and my friends are not them. They were open and happy and proud.

So I decided to come out in person, not to everybody, just those friends that didn't know. Not the best way, as I blurted out "I'm bi!" and the pause of silence was nearly deafening. But they looked at me, and were were cool with it. You're still you but you just like boobs too. Hugs of more pride and stuff but they don't treat me any different and I love them for it.

I'm still me.

Yes, things are not always brilliant, but they can be. A good support system was the thing for me and I could never regret coming out. So, if anyone does have any issues, I'm sure the kittens would help. Even me, the lurker or ex-lerker.

So I'll end it with I hope your coming out goes as well as mine did, have a happy coming out.

So, I came out nearly 4 years ago (age 14, which seems like a long time ago now). My friends and family were great about it, and I've been going out with this great girl for just over 2 years. Something I've noticed though, and I wonder if it's just me, is that when it comes to meeting new people and going through the introductory stages of talking to someone, I tend to avoid talking about my sexuality. I'd never fake being straight, but I'm ashamed to admit I've referred to my girlfriend as a "friend" before, as has she, when talking mostly to older people. Also, if I'm talking to someone that's around my age, even if the opportunity arises, I tend to avoid talking about being gay and my girlfriend etc. I don't hide it in public, we hold hands and kiss goodbye etc, and once said new person does become aware of my orientation, I'm the first one to make joke-y remarks or talk about hot women.
Any ideas as to why this may be? Anyone have a similar experience? I guess it's about breaking down barriers, in a way. Any other thoughts?

_________________
"Just enjoy your life. That's really the trick. Everything else falls into place if you do that." - Tweet I got from Amber Benson.

Hi Tjwiltshire,
I have exactly the same problem! I'm not dating anyone currently, but I have these random moments where I just go to ridiculous lengths to avoid mentioning my sexuality. It's not on purpose, it just happens. I think it's probably a mix of reflexes left over from being in the closet and just a natural instinct to avoid saying anything that might make you suddenly different from everyone else. At least, that's how it is for me.

Hi guys,

I've known that I'm a lesbian for a couple of years now. I'm rather open about it. But there are some things that stop me from totally coming out to the world. My parents know I'm gay, I told them last year. I have a bad relationship with my parents, I can't connect with them and they make jokes about gay people. I always feel uncomfortable around them. And honestly, I want to move to England, one of them reasons is that I don't want to be close to them anymore.
When I was younger I was bullied all the time, I didn't have friends and I got a very low self-esteem. I still have that low self-esteem. Three years ago I adapted, I stopped making people like me for who I was and I became the shy and silent girl when I was in class or with other groups of people. I'm graduating high school in a couple of weeks and I want to leave that person behind me. Because that's not me.
I have decided to come out when I'm starting at the college in the Fall. But I don't want to come out to the people of my highschool. I can't deal with my past. I tried it, but I just want to run away from it.
I want someone to love me for who I am, I want someone to hold me. I want to have all these amazing experiences, but there is no one here for me.
I'm not moving out of my family home this year, I'm going to try for next year, but I don't have the money yet. I lock myself up in my room, I never watch TV shows on the television in our living room. Because when I watch a show there, my parents will make fun of me.
I'm just really the black sheep in the family. I want to move out and never come back to this place, I hate it here. Too many bad things have happened here. This is the short version, I could talk for hours and everything is complicated.

Does anyone know what to do, because I don't.

Mels

_________________
There was this entire verse about the couscous - Tara

Hey Mels aka foxycas,

I'm not at a proper computer so I will have to expound on this later but I wanted to leave something now. The short version is, I have been in your shoes. My parents weren't as bad as yours when I came out but I came out during a shit storm of other emotional issues I was trying (and honestly failing) to deal with at the time. I came out when I was 15 and with the other shit I was dealing with, being gay was the least of my worries. But I remember all too well that feeling of isolation that you are going through now. Hang in there. It does get better. As cliche as it sounds it does. The biggest thing that would help is to stand up to your parents and set some boundaries now that your older. As scary and insane as the idea sounds you would be amazed the freedom you can find in doing so. Draw that line in the sand and say "This is me. If you want me in your lofe still this what you are going to have to accept." Unfortunately it sounds like you are going to have to wait until you you move out but you can start now with smaller boundaries. Push back to them when they make you uncomfortable with their remarks. Most of the time it is a parent's ignorance that causes us the most pain and a big part of our growth as kids is to start expressing ourselves to them so they understand us better. After that if they decide to still ignorant ass hats, then fuck em. Family is what you make it and blood does mean much at the end of the day. My girlfriend (who is so much more to me than that term implies) is prime example of that. She has the barest contact with her blood family and now lives 2 states away so she can spread her wings and grow.

gah I rambling more than I planned this morning....sorry. I just saw so much similarity to myself at that age in your post I had to share my experiences now that it is almost 10 years in my past (and seriously when did that happen?!)

The other point I wanted to touch on was your comment on running from your past. Sadly that is not possible. True you can run from the people in your past and honestly, I say go for it if it will give you a fresh start. But the feelings, emotions and traumas of the past have to be faced and dealt with. They have to be processed and understood for them not to get in the way of the new future you so desperately want and deserve. I am speaking from the experience of 2 failed long term relationships that failed partislly because of my un-dealt with past (there is probably a more eloquent way to put that but don't judge, I haven't had my chai yet this morning). Granted my partners failed me in ways too but it was also their past baggage that got in the way of us too, especially my last girlfriend. I have already started working on my own with my issues but my girlfriend is now giving me the biggeat boost in facing my past demons. And every time I open and face one more if those with her we become closer and stronger together. She has already done this work and is now acting as my guide to help me process this stuff. So take your fresh start at college and run with it. Enjoy it. But don't forget where you came from. Don't forget the fires you have been through already that have forged you into the person you are. Because that person is beautiful and I am sure there are people out there waiting to show you just that.

Ok so apparently I just wrote this all out on the fly and now I am late for work. My Yoda moment is done. I hope none of this came off as condescending as that is the furthest thing from my intentions. It was meant more as a "there is a light at the end of the tunnel but still work to do after you get there" advice. Hope it helps.

~Leo

Sent from Tapatalk 2 (please forgive any thumb-lies)

Hi Leo,

Thank you for the support and the advice.
My parents and I never talk about the gay thing. They act like they forgot, but they secretly told my entire family (grandmas and all) that I'm gay. They outed me without asking my permission. To this day they still deny that they told anyone back then, but they are lying. They are the only ones who knew at that time. And a couple of friends, but they couldn't have contacted my family. I already reached the point that I want to say screw you and leave the house and never come back. When I told them about me, they were totally supportive and now they sort of started repressing it. I can't relax when I am around them, I don't want to be around them anymore.
The uncomfortable feeling had already started before I figured out I'm gay. It's been years. I just can't connect with them.

Sometimes it's just hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel. Because of my insecurities about basically everything about me, I find it hard to feel good enough for anything and good about myself. This started when I was about 10 years old, because people always told me that I wasn't good enough for anything or anyone. I know I have to deal with my issues, but I don't have anyone I know, that I trust enough with those things. Because I deal with my issues by talking about them.

I don't want to see the people who hurt me daily anymore. I really need a fresh start and I have been looking for it for years. But I feel like I can't run from everything yet, I still live at home, so I'm stuck to my parents and hometown. I'm just sick and tired of the waiting.

Sorry for causing you to be late. Thank you for the support. It means a lot to me.

_________________
There was this entire verse about the couscous - Tara

((hugs)) you are very welcome Mels, I am glad I could help. My friends are the only thing that came me sane and alive when I was in that same place. My best advice for where you are at, is put your head down for now and find a few things that give you joy to get you through. That will get you to the place where you can get the hell out of dodge, get out of your parent's place and get a fresh start. That is when the fun begins. You can stretch your wings, stumble around, trip on stuff, make new discoveries and really find yourself. It is scary as hell moving out but also extremely freeing. Once you have been able to really stretch your wings and find yourself you can try reconnecting with your parents and find out how you fit in each other's lives now that you are your own person. I still have sticking points with my parents, especially my mother. I have to revert, to some degree, to the same auto pilot that got me through my last few years with them, when I visit them. But I have also been introducing pieces of myself to them over time. I have found this to be the easiest way to see what they can accept and so far it has gone well. But there is also a large part of me I don't share with them. There is too much pain, scars and trauma from childhood to be able to fully mend some bridges. So I keep those parts of myself to share with my good friends and my partners, those people who have more recently come into my life instead of being there the whole time.
If you don't have anyone you can talk to now, friend or partner-wise, I would recommend finding a therapist you can connect with. I haven't gone this route personally, but my girlfriend has had good success with this. It takes some time and some discomfort to find a therapist you are comfortable talking to but it can help a lot. Personally, I can't open up to strangers, that is why my girlfriend has been an absolute gods sent gift that she is willing to take this journey with me. And remember you have us here at the KB to talk to you if you need someone to lean on. Lots of us have gone through similar situations and deal with our own issues and we understand. Also feel free to PM me if you need to talk. I'm on the KB pretty frequently.

~Leo

I have found a thing I found joy in, Tv shows and art (I have a thread with my W/T art stuff). I put all my love and emotions in those things. It helps me. Characters like Tara help me through the day. Just the thought of her puts a smile on my face. I guess you are right. I need to hold onto those things, I think they will help me through the day.
I find living on my own very freeing, every year my family goes on a holiday a couple of times. Every summer they leave for 2/3 weeks, and I don't come along. I stay at home. And honestly, those weeks are the best moments of the year.
I'll have to start working to get extra money and perhaps I can move out within a year.
Thank you so much for all the support. From this point I don't know what's gonna happen, but I'm gonna keep my head low and hold onto things I love.

Mels <3

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There was this entire verse about the couscous - Tara

I've been out to myself for almost 7 years now. My co-workers and friends know but still haven't been able to tell my parents. I think I would be a much happier person if I did but I just feel like my parents would disown me. Some people say who cares if you're parent's don't accept you, you are your own person. Yes that's true I don't need them to financially support me. I don't really even see my parent's that much anymore but it's nice to know I'm always welcomed home. With me coming out to them I don't always feel I would be welcomed. I have a girlfriend of 5 years and we do plan to get married. I feel this urge to tell my parents but I really don't know if it's worth it. They would never accept me and never come to my wedding. But I feel i'd be happier if I did. i'm still working on coming out and I'm 32!!

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"There is never a pill strong enough to make me feel the way all your fingers could."

Wow, i feel for you guys.

Y'all definitely has lesbian street cred.

I'd make a sneaky comment about Rainbow Warriors, but there's that whole Greenpeace thing

Stay strong, and when you DO spread your wings and fly, let us know ok?

R

_________________
“All I feel is sunlight. All I hear is music.” Willow
How i Met Your Mother - By Ariel

My Story: Coming Home

Hello Kittens
I'm not new here. I had an account here 2 years ago, but my laptop crashed (again!) and I forgot a password for the old account Unfortunately I'm still not out to anyone. Few weeks ago there was something about gay people on tv and my parents started talking how gay people are sick, not normal. They said this things with some much hate that I lost hope for ever telling them. I also tried to find out if some of my friends change their minds about gay people. Some of them didn't change and others said they don't mind gay people .......as long as it's not one of their friends. I'm getting depressed. I really need to move to another country. Unfortunately I'm still saving money for that.

Hi Michiru,

I am sad to hear this, it breaks my heart. There are plenty of websites online that can give you the opportunity to talk, there are actual professionals who might be able to help you, but I get that's scary. I have no idea where you are from but I know that there are usually LGBT centres in the bigger cities. The most important part is that you accept yourself for who you are and that you should always be true to yourself. You should love yourself because you are the person you are gonna be with your entire life and that person is beautiful and perfectly imperfect.

Which country would you like to move to?

You can always message me if you want to talk, I have been there, maybe not as extreme but I know what you are going through.

It is going to be all right, Michi

_________________
There was this entire verse about the couscous - Tara

Hi Michiru. I am sorry to hear about your dilemma and I can relate to a degree. I have struggled with the idea of coming out to my parents and some other parts of my family because at times they can be scared or hateful of homosexuality. I don't know if I will ever feel comfortable telling them. I also understand how scary it can be to reach to other people as friends and confidantes without knowing their feelings or views. And people say the most ignorant and harmful things such as "I don't mind gay people as long as they aren't one of my friends/come near me/etc..."

I think you have the right idea about staying focused on the future. You are still saving money, but eventually you will be able to move to somewhere friendlier and more open-minded. And I second what foxycas recommended: There are some amazing resources online. You can form connections and support through online communities and may even be able to find support groups or other connections around where you live.

Hang in there and I hope you start to feel better.

_________________
Under Your Spell: A Willow/Tara Fanfiction Podcast

My mother knew before me...!
I kissed a girl when I was 7, she was my child-minders daughter and we hid underneath her desk, I never saw her after that summer and that was that...

I never really came out, I just was who I was and my mother let that happen. She never questioned just accepted.
I came out to friends and people at work, but I've been really lucky so far... They say: have you got a boyfriend? and I say nope, my girlfriends name is...

There was some shitty stuff in my first high school and it would have been crap, but I moved schools (because we moved house) and I met an incredible bunch of 12 miss-fits, and we all fitted together perfectly.

I was always out to them but only one of them came out to me while at school, and another- I watched The L Word with her but never pushed her, and when we left for uni there was 4 of us 'out'. Funny how you're drawn to people without knowing why.. gaydar!

Sometimes I weirdly feel like an outsider because I haven't really struggled with coming out yet, but the crappy thing to remember is, we have to come out all the time. Every time we meet a new friend, get a new job, go to a new doctor... it's tough but once you make that first step, it really does get better.

_________________
"I am you know..."


YouTube channel 'T-Sixteen NRG' for my fanvids
www.youtube.com/channel/UCXvNuQHd2HA0BaaVMBIIMfQ
(okay so there's only a few right now but I'm 'new' to it so watch this space!)

It is so true! Every time I meet a new person, I have to decide whether I will come out to them or when I will come out to them. It really depends on the person, the situation, and even how I am feeling in that moment!

And your mom is awesome for simply accepting you as you are!

_________________
Under Your Spell: A Willow/Tara Fanfiction Podcast

Coming out as gay was never particularly difficult for me. Or at least, it felt difficult with my family and close friends but they always took it pretty well, and I've been open with coworkers and new acquaintances for so long it just feels normal. But coming out as nonbinary feels like a near-constant struggle. My partner and her friends are great, but everyone else in my life... I have to correct my best friend nearly every conversation on pronouns and/or name, though I know she's trying, and my mom just doesn't seem to get it.

But what has been really hard is work. I started a new position almost 6 months ago, and even though it was terrifying I put it in my bio that I'm nonbinary and use they/them pronouns. I'm guessing no one ever read it, because no one ever addressed me properly. I was way too intimidated and nervous to tell anyone face to face. One time a month or two ago I had a conversation with a couple coworkers about trans people and pronouns and I mentioned "I use they/them" but I think they somehow didn't realize I was talking about using them for myself. Nothing changed. I had a meeting with my boss a few weeks ago and brought up being nonbinary; at the time she seemed dismissive, but she asked me questions a couple weeks later, I explained they/them pronouns, and she seemed like she wanted to be respectful. The next day she referred to me as she, and nothing changed. By now I've been working with everyone for over 5 months and the idea of correcting anyone at this point seems... impossible.
I don't like being called by the wrong pronouns, and especially referred to as a girl or lady which happens a lot at work, but I think the main thing that bothers me is feeling like I'm living a double life, like I'm not being honest and open about who I am.

I wish I weren't so scared and intimidated. I wish I could figure out how to be brave.

_________________
"To days to come."
"All my love to long ago.

I hope, we'll have more happy ever after
I hope, we can all live more fearlessly...

~Jas

Yep. Trans is the new gay, and NB is the new trans.
If you're trans, everyone is hating on you.
And if you're NB, everyone is ignoring you or laughing at you.

I'm lucky in that it hardly ever comes up at work, and when it does, it's no big deal.
But my experience is not that of everyone else.
And i'm never sure if people actually register it, or just accept it as 'yeah, they're an oddball. That's what they do.'

Also, i do live in the country that keeps topping the charts for happiness, lack of religion and societal health.
So, not the US.

One thing i do that demonstrates how people don't notice these things, is to refer to everyone by gender neutral pronouns, unless specifically asked not to.
I've been doing it for a year, and so far, no one has noticed



As to your situation, i cannot tell you what to do, or what the right thing is.

But i can tell you what i would do and why, and you can decide if it is helpful to you.

I would do a cost/benefit analysis. Consider how i feel at work every day. Consider how i would feel at work every day, if my identity was known and respected.

And then consider how much crap is worth putting up with, to go from one to the other.
After all, if your job sucks, and you hate it, above and beyond this spoecific issue, it might not be worth it, because your day might not be any better.

If the job is great, other than this one thing, then it might be worth a good deal of hassle to change this one thing.

So me, i consider the worst possible outcome. Usually getting fired. Maybe having everyone treat you weird for a while.
Then i face that, and work through what it would mean, mentally prepare myself for it. PRepare for the worst.
Then consider: is that cost worth it?
Is what I get, my peace of mind, worth that cost?

If yes, do it.
If not, do not.

This will remove most of the stress from the situation. Because I already dealt with it. And now I don't have to think anymore, I just have to do it.

Shut up, because it's just not worth it.
Or step out into the light, because it is.

The only difference between the brave and the timid, is being willing to pay the price.

Now, if the smart thing to do is keep quiet, then nothing need be done.
If however, I decide that it's worth the price, then I need to manage this in a sane way.
Ideally, assertively, but not aggressively or confrontationally.

What I would do, is not make a big deal about it, but don't back down from it.
Don't make a big deal about it, like circulate an email or have a department meeting about it, but be clear.

I would put it on my name tag or desk/door label: "They/Them."
Whenever someone mentions you as 'she' in your presence, just say 'actually, i prefer neutral pronouns like they/them.'

Any time someone sends you an email like that, just send one back 'Thanks for the email, but i use neutral pronouns, just for the future.' and so on.

And forgive yourself.
Admit to yourself, that while it may have made it easier to put your foot down earlier, you are where you are.
And really, it's not going to make that much difference.
So forgive yourself for not doing it earlier, and do it now.

And if someone wants to get into it like on a forum, I just point out, that this is a workplace, not a pub, and that sex and gender are not topics for discussion here, and that maybe they should check in with HR or the boss, if they disagree.
And we are all required to respect each other, whatever our personal beliefs are.

And I have language and habit backing me. Zie and Zir would be a harder sell, but neutral pronouns, like i use for myself, are what everyone uses when they don't know the gender of person X.



Anyhoo, that's my bit. Feel free to PM me, or email me if you wanna chat.
And all the best, yeah?

R

_________________
“All I feel is sunlight. All I hear is music.” Willow
How i Met Your Mother - By Ariel

My Story: Coming Home