New to Beta Pens? Not sure where to find what you need? Start here.

• This thread aims to answer all your questions about how the forum works, what it's here for etc.
• If you can’t find an answer to your question in the FAQ, ask it here. The FAQ will be periodically updated.
• If you’d like to raise issues or problems with the forum, here’s the place to do so.
• If you have a suggestion for the forum, raise it here.
• If you’d like to offer constructive feedback on the forum itself, place it in this thread.

Make sure you've had a look at the main Kitten FAQs. Please take a moment to familiarise yourself with the content guidelines (in the Pens FAQ). Beta Pens is only for discussion of ideas that fall within that rubric. If you're not sure if your idea is suitable, please contact the moderators.

• What kind of fiction is this board for?
  
  Beta Pens is for in-development W/T fic. Completed chapters still go in Pens.
  
  Beta Pens was specifically created to encourage new writers and offer support for more experienced writers.
  
• Why should I try writing?
  
  Writing is an amazing way to find a window into yourself and share wonderful stories with friends and total strangers.
  
  Look around. See how the beta process and the different writing processes work. Everyone is different! Realize that constructive criticism is (relatively) painless and a beta reader’s desire is only to help you put the very best of you on paper. Pick up new writing exercises. Learn to get through writer’s block or find the time to write. Let’s get that pen moving!
  
• Why should I offer my comments? Why would anyone want to hear what I think?
  
  Offered constructively and sensitively, ALL feedback is valid. Criticism can be one line or a long essay. However much it takes to offer your support. Everyone's insight and perspective is different. It could be your specific perspective that clicks with the author and allows them the spark of inspiration or insight that they need. Just read carefully what's been written and be thoughtful in the way you comment.
  
• What kind of help can I get here?
  
  Writers (both new and experienced) are working through their respective processes here in this forum. Sometimes you can learn by observation and other times it’s best to ask a question outright. The beta readers are here for you, the writer. They can make specific suggestions in your working fic, give you resources outside the forum (books, websites, etc.) and you may find the right someone or someone’s to beta your work one-on-one.
  
• I want to write. How do I get started?
  
  Have a look around first. Read through the characterization, plot, grammar, etc. threads.
  
  Then have a look at the Initial Ideas thread. Here writers are batting around ideas with others in the forum for a story they are considering. You’ll find initial discussions on plot, setting, characterization, research that may be necessary and more.
  
  Next, look through at least two Developing threads to get a feel for how the Beta Pens process really works. Chapter rough drafts will be posted and then commented on by any number of betas. Writers and beta readers may debate comments, develop ideas for changes and then post revisions. The flow of post, comment and revision shows the developing life of the story.
  
  The following are examples of Developing stories:
  
  What Hides Beneath the Grey
  Pandora's Box
  Through a Glass, Darkly
  
  Now that you think you’ve got the hang of it, it’s time to jump into the water!
  
  If you only have a very rough idea, why not post to the Initial Ideas thread first? Get some feedback and discuss it. When you’ve worked out enough detail then you can move onto starting a Developing Story thread. Do this by opening your own thread titled Developing: … where … is something that will differentiate your thread from all others since you probably won’t have a title yet. For example: “Developing:W/T in Africa”, or “Develpoing:Tara Resurrection”. Then throw your detailed plot idea into the thread for debate. Pose questions, identify areas for research, brainstorm, outline.
  
  Get it to a point where you think you’re ready to start writing, write your first part and post it. Then the beta process really gets going. At this point, you may have a title or working title. Post rough draft chapters, possibly revisions and begin working with the betas.
  
  It’s possible you’ve been working away on your own and already have a rough draft that you’d like to beta. No problem! Just start up a Developing thread and seed it with your work so far.
  
• So just to be clear then...when do I post in Initial Ideas and when Should I move to a Developing:... thread?
  
  Initial Ideas is for ideas which aren't really thought out in detail. A flash of inspiration that can be caught in a few lines maybe. It's a place to share the initial excitement of the idea, get something written down and garner some first impressions and early feedback. Once your idea matures a little, start up a Developing thread and carry on the discussion there. You may wish to seed your developing thread with a summary of what's been discussed in Initial Ideas.
  
• I’ve already got a story in progress in Pens, can I start posting beta versions of new chapters here?
  
  Absolutely yes.
  
  Start a Developing thread and post the next piece you want feedback for. You may want to post your outline or some introductory notes to help readers understand where you’re planning to go with the story.
  
• Why not just have one thread per idea? Won't having lots of ideas in Initial Ideas be confusing?
  
  The difficulty here is that some ideas may not come to fruition or may develop very slowly. It's possible that the number of threads could get high very quickly if everyone started a new thread straight away.
  
  Having Developing threads start with fairly mature ideas or initial chapters means that any reader looking to offer support or feedback can go to a Developing thread knowing there will likely be a lot to comment on.
  
  Initial Ideas will be a cauldron of ideas to debate in quicker fashion. Different ideas may meld together, or relate to each other, combine mutate etc. Initial Ideas (if it's working) should contain shorter running debates on ideas that either lead the author to readiness to start Developing or change their minds and rework their idea.
  
• I want to offer feedback and beta support. What do I do?
  
  Easy. If you're commenting on an idea in Initial Ideas, read through the author's original idea post, scan through additional feedback. Post your thoughts.
  
  If your responding to a full Developing story, read the story (carefully), scan through additional comments. See if the author is after specific help, then post your thoughts.
  
  Be considerate and sensitive in what you post. An author is putting themselves out there by sharing their idea. Try to be thoughtful and empathise if you can.
  
• How do I leave detailed feedback?
  
  There is only so much detail that can be easily expressed through this board. It's not very easy to make detailed grammatical or spelling corrections to a long text without a very long winded response. However, you can still cover these areas by pointing out trends and patterns. For example, you could highlight common grammatical errors. You may recommend the author uses a spell checker to pick up spelling issues.
  
  Style, pace, structure, plot, research (and more) issues can more easily be pointed out by just alluding to the issues. If they're recurring issues, you could point out a couple of examples and suggest the author study the text for the rest.
  
  Creative use of quoting will perhaps help.
  
  Should you wish to comment in very great detail you may wish to contact the author directly and request a copy of the text to embed inline comments and return a response in that way.
  
  As this forum evolves we hope to evolve more creative ways of developing feedback. The hope is that the real value is in many constructive comments from a diversity of people.
  
• As an author, with so many people commenting it sounds like I could get conflicting advice. Who do I listen to?
  
  Anybody who gives comment is offering their opinion in the knowledge that you may take their advice or go a different way.
  
  Having a range of sources of comment allows you to see trends in the reactions to your work. A range of different reactions to your work may help you realise that your work is not generating the uniform reaction you wanted. The diversity alone may be enough to get you started on rework until you get the required consensus. Alternatively, you may get a variety of equally interesting views about how to develop your work. Sometimes the range of comments may be complementary. Other times you may see a range of mutually exclusive but equally interesting ideas that stimulate your thinking to where it needs to get to.
  
  In the end, what goes onto the page is your decision.
  
• What happens if I don't immediately see feedback?
  
  Depending on how busy this board gets, feedback may not be absolutely immediate. However, it should be emphasised that a premise of Beta Pens is to bring many people capable of comment into a concentrated writing area. Also the board aims to encourage more people to comment and develop their sense of "beta-ness". Beta Pens aims to make diversity of feedback available quickly. Do be patient, but equally consider using your Developing thread (or Initial Ideas) if appropriate to think out loud. You may find this will help stimulate response.
  
• What are the standing threads on writing?
  
  Grammar, Punctuation and Spelling
  Characterization
  PoV
  How to Finish a Story
  Research/Creative Help
  So you wanna be a Beta?
  Titles
  Writer's Block
  Structure and Plot
  Having Doubts?
  Inspiration
  
• What if my question doesn't fit with any of these topics?
  
  For this to work, the forum needs to be easy to keep organised and importantly, easy to navigate. There’s a reasonable chance there’s a thread that’ll cover the writing question you have. If there doesn’t seem to be a place to ask your question, or you’re not sure where to ask your question, ask it here first.

Here's some feedback...

Thanks to everyone who's contributed so far. Particularly thanks to people who've been brave enough to put themsevles out there and post Developing stories.

It feels like this forum is starting to develop nicely. I think it's always good when people offer to beta, individually or in this way. I am really intrigued to see where this may develop.

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There's nothing very merry 'bout going round and round.

Hey there,
I'm actually completely new to the board, but where do you get a Beta? I mean, do I just go ask some random writer I like?
I like writing fanfictions and getting positive feedbeack, but as an aspiring writer, I need someone to tell me "you need to work on this" or "this is really weak" and I know my writing will improve if I have one of these fantastic writers helping me.
So, yeah, my question is: where do I find a Beta?

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"She practically had plastic stamped on her ass.....just trying a little spicey talk."
-Tara

Welcome to the Kitten!

You definitely came to the right place if you're in need of beta-ing. That's the point of this whole forum. If you read the first post in this thread, it explains how you can get some help here with your ideas or with a work-in-progress if you have one.

If you'd rather work one-on-one with a beta in private, check out the One-on-One Authors / Beta Readers thread. You'll find two people in there willing to be betas.

Best of luck with your fic!

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I have one bitty suggestion -

I don't think the fic ideas in the "initial ideas" thread are at that point, but could something be added to first post asking writers to edit their initial post about a story when they are far enough past the "initial" stage that comments are no longer necessary there? Or, maybe, edit the first post for a new initial idea when a 'developing' thread is opened? I definitely wouldn't suggest removing posts entirely once an idea is no longer "initial" - looking back on those discussions is going to be great (I'm a dork - I know this), but it seems like it would be easier for people to jump in as this board gets more traffic (which I really hope it will, because this is a seriously awesome idea).

-Sass

Great idea, Sass! I've edited the first post in the Initial Ideas thread and added the bolded to one of the points:



I can imagine what a headache it could be, when BP and that Initial Ideas thread are bigger, to keep up with who still wants comments in that thread and who doesn't or who's got a Developing thread for which fic.

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Excellent suggestion, looks even clearer now.

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There's nothing very merry 'bout going round and round.

Uhm, just saying, thanks a lot for the threads in this board. I meant the tips and suggestions (not to my fic; never posted here) for writers. They showed me the potholes to evade, so thanks.

I have a question about Sex! Umm ... the thread titled 'Sex!', not the actual mechanics of the, uhhh ... errr ... *mumble mumble*

So, I was wondering if the Beta Pens board has a naughty word filter that stops posts with naughty words? Awhile back I attempted to post on this topic regarding a question about beta-reading a sex scene that's, well, badly written (IIRC - as I said, this was awhile back). I used examples. Said examples had naughty words. My reply would not post, so I was wondering if this was the board being wonky, or if I was inadvertently introducing naughty words into a naughty-word-free zone?

And even if it was just the board being wonky, is there a way to mark that thread as being NC-17? Because using, umm ... examples with the, uhh ... naughty words ... would be very informative.

From a technical writing perspective.

-Sass

QUESTION: Have any of the stories in the "Initial Idea" thread been posted yet? The Viking/Irish tale? The WWII AU?? Others???

There aren't any filters for naughty words..
let me test

pussy
cunt
fuck
hmm

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moliendo café

If there were, half the fics in this place would be unreadable.

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Avatar Images Courtesy of Kirari-PGSM.net
The Star Witches Saga | Under the Sea | The Moonlight Densetsu Chronicles | Going the Distance | Slippery When Wet | Short Fics by Sith

I have an odd question and since you said that I did not know where to put to put it here first that is what I am going to do. You see I have a story idea but do not worry I am not here about the story it self since I know very well that I have to go to the Initial Ideas thread for that, which is whre I plan to go next.

My question is that a least one of my characters comes form an alternative Universe/ non cannon verse, namely the Lost Slayer Arc. the and I was wondering if it would be considered a crossover or what not. i would like to thank you all in advance for helping me out.

Hey!

I'm new to everything here. Well, not really. I kinda just lurked around for a while... a long while..
Anyway.
I wanna write a Tara/Willow fanfiction, but I really have no experience in writing. So I'm very terrified of posting anything that I might write. I'm VERY self-conscious...
So. I was wondering...
What's the difference between the Beta Pens and the Different Color Pens? I looked above at the FAQ, but I still don't get int xD
I'm attempting to write something right now, and if I get a good start I might wanna post it, but I really don't know where.

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"Your tears don't fall,
They crash around me.."

Hi.

Beta Pens is where you can try ideas out on people. You post your idea, or a part of the story and people will give advice that you ask for. You could also use that to lure a beta reader to your side, to let them see if they would be interested in the story. However you probably wouldn't post your whole story here. Beta Pens is when it's not finished and you are looking for help/opinions on the concept/style/technical side.

Different Coloured Pens is where you post your story when it's ready to show to the world. Essentially that is where the finished version goes and you'll get feedback accordingly.

Hope that helps.

Katharyn

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If I wanted a little pussy, I've got my own to play with.

Chance in *Chance*
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Is it ok to ask for help here for a Buffyverse fic that I don't plan to post in the KB? (because it's a Buffy/Faith based fic rather then Willow/Tara.)