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A complaint.....

Salem Witch Trials, koala bears, SpongeBob: what's on TV and at the movies!

Re: MPAA

Postby BFR from Paris » Thu May 12, 2005 11:51 pm

They are so stupid... :happy

It's like the debate over here about illegal downloads of music/movies! They're all like, "it's killing the record industry and the movie industry" (whiny voice) and guess what? Record sales and movie ticket sales are up! Go figure...

I just don't see what the problem is with downloading episodes of a TV show that hasn't come out on DVD yet, where do they lose money? Commercials? Please, nobody watches commercials anymore (thank you Tivo)! Plus, a lot of people outside the US download these shows because that's the only way for us to watch them!! It doesn't mean we won't buy the DVD boxset when it's released (I did for L Word season 1)! Those BT sites are actually the best publicity for a bunch of new shows, because now people want to sample before they buy. I wouldn't be surprised if US TV shows were picked up in other countries based on their online popularity! If the industry can't adapt, too bad for them. While they could set up a system like napster for TV shows, what do they do? Sue. That's typical. Well, like Mylène says, "F@%# them all !"

Edited because I got carried away with the insults ;)
ETA again: thanks Justin for the article, see this is exactly what I'm talking about! :eyebrow
Last edited by BFR from Paris on Sun May 15, 2005 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby justin » Sun May 15, 2005 12:47 pm

Here's one look at the effects of downloading TV programs,

Piracy is good? How Battlestar Galatica killed broadcast TV

One of the main points is that since BSG was shown in the UK before America, and was available very quickly as a BitTorrent you would have expected the ratings to have been very low when shown in America. However due to the free advertising from the people who had watched the BitTorrent and liked it, it was one of the SciFi channels highest rating shows.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby sam7777 » Mon May 16, 2005 2:26 pm

Thing is the MPAA studios all want pay for play and don't care if they get free publicity that helps a program. They want CONTROL of when you see a show, it's web site and all publicity. They want a TV show paid for multiple times: by US networks the first time, then syndicated repeats, then overseas airings, then DVD etc etc etc.
http://www.linuxelectrons.com/article.php/20050512214338719
MPAA Takes New Action Against TV Show Thieves
MPAA officials said they have been making progress in shutting down many of the BitTorrent sites that are dedicated to illegally swapping movies. Over 90 percent of the sites that have been sued have been shut down entirely. The percent of servers that are operating have decreased by well over 40 percent. On some of these torrent site’s original homepages like Lokitorrent, UK Torrent and s0nicfreak there now appears the MPAA warning message: “You Can Click But You Cannot Hide.” (http://www.uk-torrents.com http://www.uk-torrents.net http://www.s0nicfreak.com http://www.lokitorrent.com ) MPAA said it hopes to work with these torrent sites to provide entertainment products legally like it does with Napster.

“Since we began shutting these sites down, the time that it takes to download a file on BitTorrent has increased exponentially which means the experience of downloading copyrighted films and TV shows is not what it used to be,” said Glickman. “We intend to make it even worse. Protecting the television industry is essential.”
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby Sheridan » Tue May 17, 2005 12:22 pm

I thought that article was quite incisive. Most people who download would happily pay the creators of a show for their product, advertisers will find a way to place their products, with icons, tickers or just putting them in the show. The only people who will lose out are the networks, faced with being about as relevant as gas lamp makers or producers of buggy whips, hardly surprising really that they are putting up such a fight. This also put a question mark against this talk of legal downloads, after all with music the companies aren't wholly tied to radio stations but with TV its a different story. I suspect the first production company trying to legally distribute material will suddenly find it doesn't get anymore network commisions.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby sam7777 » Fri May 27, 2005 1:40 pm

The MPAA has put another Bittorrent site out of business:
http://p2pnet.net/story/4970
Elite Torrents takedown genuine

p2pnet.net News:- Homeland Security, the FBI's Cyber Division and US Immigration and Customs Enforcement, “today the first criminal enforcement action targeting individuals committing copyright infringement on peer-to-peer (P2P) networks using cutting edge file-sharing technology known as BitTorrent”.

Acting as inspiration was the movie cartel’s MPAA (Motion Picture Association of America).

“This morning, agents of the FBI and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) executed 10 search warrants across the United States against leading members of a technologically sophisticated P2P network known as Elite Torrents,” says a statement.

“Employing technology known as BitTorrent, the Elite Torrents network attracted more than 133,000 members and, in the last four months, allegedly facilitated the illegal distribution of more than 17,800 titles - including movies and software - which were downloaded 2.1 million times.
I fear Bittorrent will be the next Napster, litigated out od existence.

url]http://p2pnet.net/story/4975[/url]
Was the 'Sith' leak deliberate?

p2pnet.net News:- The appearance online of Revenge of the Sith before its official release raises some interesting questions, particularly in light of yesterday’s take-down of the Elite Torrent BitTorrent indexing site.

Was the leak in fact a honey trap set up by the MPAA to give bounty hunters a clear shot at nailing torrent users?

That’s what a couple of emails from people who prefer to remain anonymous suggest, a possibility bolstered by the fact that in their press statement, the FBI and US Immigration and Customs Enforcement were able to state, very specifically, that Episode III - Revenge of the Sith was, “available for downloading on the network more than six hours before it was first shown in theatres” and in the next 24 hours, “was downloaded more than 10,000 times”.

Fast work for hide-bound federal agencies which normally need weeks of committeee meetings and countless signed approvals before they can move.
I certainly wouldn't put it past them.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby sam7777 » Thu Aug 25, 2005 2:38 pm

The MPAA is nowing looking at logs from Bittorrent site to sue individual file downloaders ala the RIAA attacks:
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9588_22-5843082.html
Studios mine P2P logs to sue swappers
Hollywood studios filed a new round of lawsuits against file swappers on Thursday, for the first time using peer-to-peer companies' own data to track down individuals accused of trading movies online.

The Motion Picture Association of America said it filed 286 lawsuits against people around the United States based on information acquired from file-trading sites shut down earlier in the year. Most of those sites were hubs connecting people using the BitTorrent technology, a peer-to-peer application designed for speeding downloads of large files.

The group previously said in February that a Texas court had ordered that the server logs of one big site, called LokiTorrent, be turned over to Hollywood investigators. An MPAA spokeswoman said that none of Thursday's suits were related to that action, however.

Hollywood lawyers are hoping that the fear of exposure will dissuade more people from trying to download movies for free online.

"Internet movie thieves be warned: You have no friends in the online community when you are engaging in copyright theft," MPAA Senior Vice President John Malcom said in a statement.

Studios launched an aggressive new campaign against individual file swappers and peer-to-peer services last December, in particular targeting the BitTorrent hubs that served as jumping-off points for downloading a wide array of software and movies.

Many of the most popular sites, including SuprNova, LokiTorrent and others, have since shut down, either voluntarily or on the heels of lawsuits.

Although it is widely used for piracy, BitTorrent is increasingly being tapped for wholly legitimate applications such as distributing open-source software. Web browser company Opera Software has even built the technology into the latest version of its Net-surfing software.

BitTorrent creator Bram Cohen has warned in the past that using his technology to distribute material illegally is a "dumb idea," because the file-swapping tool is not designed to hide the identity of anyone using it.

As with previous lawsuits filed by the MPAA and the Recording Industry Association of America, this round of cases is aimed at anonymous "John Does" identified only by their Internet addresses. The defendants' true identities will be sought through a later court process.
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Being good to fans generates sales

Postby sam7777 » Wed Dec 14, 2005 11:10 am

I've never understood how the RIAA and MPAA (and other I won't name) think that alienating their fans is good for business. A loyal fan base can sustain a small industry as well as provide support in bad times. The Anima industry at least knows better:

Animé, piracy and profits: The Japanese-style animation business has figured out a way to live with piracy and keep fans buying
As mainstream showbiz continues its cat-and-mouse quest to protect its intellectual property, one tiny niche has figured out a way around the problem: Anime, the Japanese style of animation that typically features saucer-eyed women and giant mechanical men, and manga, its print cousin.

Though small -- the retail market for both is worth just $625 million – this animated world is growing rapidly, with sales up 13 percent between 2002 and 2004. More, they've managed this growth by doing what Hollywood seems increasingly incapable of: winning over fans instead of fearing them.

The numbers in mainstream entertainment are bad: Hollywood box-office receipts are down 7 percent over last year's middling performance. Goldman Sachs forecasts virtually no growth in DVD sales for the major studios in 2006 and an outright decline in sales the year after that. The networks have seen a 7.4 percent drop in TV viewings by 18- to 49-year-olds so far this fall compared with last year.

Yet with anime and manga, its fans -- known as otaku -- keep showing up, cash in hand. (Translated literally, otaku is Japanese for "your household." But for obscure reasons, otaku morphed in modern Japan to connote a scarily hard-core fan; in the U.S. it's more benign and relates only to fans of anime and manga.)

This tidy little corner of the show-biz universe makes for a rare example of an entertainment niche that does more than not alienate its customers: It has found ways to keep them buying and buying.

In the process, anime and manga firms have taken on forms very different from Hollywood studios or publishing houses. They more closely resemble the constantly updating startups of Silicon Valley. Their ethos is to get the product out to the right people -- whether it's on a DVD or over a mobile phone or downloadable -- and see what happens. And if the fans are into file sharing (which they are), keep the lawyers leashed and find a way to make piracy work for you.

"Companies in this space live and die by their ability not only to produce quality product but to retain street cred with the audience," says Mike Kiley, editor-in-chief and co-founder of Tokyopop, which dominates manga in the U.S.

One of the ways they do that is by tolerating the folks who have the potential to put them out of business: pirates trading anime online. And not just trading, but competing to see who can create the best subtitled version of a particular show.

This is open-source TV programming. "Fansubbers," as they're called, can spend more than a dozen hours collectively just to get a half-hour show ready for English speakers. TV watchers in Japan start the process by recording an anime show and uploading it to the Net. Bilingual fans around the world translate the dialogue and post an English version of the show on the Internet using BitTorrent, a piece of software that allows large files to be downloaded quickly

Companies in the industry watch to see what's hot online -- using the fansubbers as a first indicator to what might play well in the U.S. The more a show is being fansubbed, the more likely it is to be a hit. Once a U.S. company licenses the show, most fansubbers -- operating off a strict code of conduct -- scour the net to make sure their versions of the show don't show up anymore. That way, they say, they're ensuring that the companies that bring anime to the U.S. can make money on their DVDs -- and spread the religion.

Do any of the stuffed with shit suits in Hollywood get that bittorent runs of their shows overseas may best be used as a way to learn what can be marketting in an overseas market?
So far, it's working. In Baltimore last summer, some 22,000 anime fans -- many dressed up as their favorite characters -- paid up to $55 each to attend the Otakon anime convention. By the second day of the three-day event, Baltimore's convention center had sold out and the scalpers started offering up tickets. Even women are starting to get into the once male-dominated action. Female fans now make up about half the attendees at the conferences.

True, it's a rather, shall we say, "elite" subset of fans who'll dress up in public as the miniskirted title character from Sailor Moon, but anime really has gone mainstream. The Cartoon Network's Adult Swim -- a late-night block of adult-oriented cartoons -- has managed for the majority of the year to be the top cable draw for 18- to 24-year-olds.

What draws them in? These cartoons all have a soap opera appeal: Plots build over the course of an unusually long season (typically 52 episodes), as characters die, fall in love, do dumb things.

On the manga side, sales have more than doubled since 2002, to $125 million in 2004, according to pop-culture market analysts ICv2.

Responding to the interest, CosmoGirl last summer began running its own manga strip on the back page of every issue. "We started hearing girls say their favorite books and favorite things to read were manga," says Ann Shoket, the magazine's executive editor. "The girls have drawn their own manga for us. Not just one weird girl -- a lot of girls."

In the U.S., the market for anime is dominated by AD Vision, a Houston-based importer and distributor, with a $150 million slice, or almost a quarter of total sales. A college dropout, CEO John Ledford started Gametronix, the predecessor to ADV, in 1991, importing Japanese videogames and hawking them out of a small storefront in Houston. The following year he bought the rights to the movie version of the videogame hit Devil Hunter Yohko.

Ledford spent around $55,000 licensing the work and producing it for the U.S. He made his money back in 90 days and never looked back. "I said, 'Hey, that's pretty good, let's try it again.' "

Since then, ADV has released more than 700 anime series on DVD. ADV gets about 90 percent of its $50 million in wholesale revenues from DVD sales, yet Ledford is determined to deliver content via whatever medium the fans want. "That's video-on-demand, that's mobile, that's going to our Web site and being able to buy an episode from us for four bucks."

Ledford thinks the key is simply keeping the fans happy -- make sure you do that and the fans will do much of your hard work for you. "The hard-core fan base is very rabid," he says. "They will get behind you as a company. You don't have to spend a dollar in marketing; you just have to be friends with them."

Keeping FANS HAPPY!?! What a novel concept. This is something that genre stuff used to know but have forgotten whether is Viacom or Fox attacking fan web sites or creators treating their fans like shit. Certainly neither Trek, Star Wars or LOTR would have the fan bases they had today, if they were treating like fans are now : as a nuisance at best and as criminals at worst. Well guess what, those folks won't be there for you next product folks nor to keep you franchise going.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby Sheridan » Wed Dec 14, 2005 3:24 pm

Its become an article of faith among the movie and record industry in the USa that piracy is destroying the industry, regardless of a total lack of proof. A great example of how exaggerated this notion is was the first season of 'Battlestar Galactica'. That showed in thr UK first and was all over the net. There were dire predictions about the effects this would have when it aired in the US, so what happened? It was one of the Sci-Fi channels highest rated shows that year.
Blaming downloaders for a decline in their industries is just an excuse to avoid admitting that they are putting out overpriced, substandard products.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby justin » Thu Dec 22, 2005 11:36 am

There is one thing that really bugs me when it happens in films and TV shows. Actually it almost has me screaming in anoyance.

Picture the scene a character finds a container of suspicious looking white powder. So what do they do? put their finger in it, raise it to their tongue and say "Mmmm, heroin-y"

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot?

They've probably never even seen heroin before, let alone tasted it, so how the frilly heck are they able to tell the difference between heroin and talcum powder? Gahh, it pisses me off royally.

Um, they did it on Lost last night and I needed to vent.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby urnofosiris » Thu Dec 22, 2005 2:40 pm

And heroin is brown, cocaine is white, but I am sure they both taste nasty.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby SySnootles » Thu Dec 22, 2005 2:51 pm

I do believe there is a refining process which makes heroin white-ish. Not totally white, like cocaine, but white-ish. And I can't speak for heroin, but cocaine has a very distinctive taste.

EDIT: Found some info to back up my statement... from A fact sheet on heroin
Heroin comes in various forms, but pure heroin is a white powder with a bitter taste. Most illicit heroin comes in powder form in colors ranging from white to dark brown. The colors are due to the impurities left from the manufacturing process or the presence of additives. “Black tar” is another form of heroin that resembles roofing tar or is hard like coal. Color varies from dark brown to black.
Last edited by SySnootles on Thu Dec 22, 2005 7:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby umgaynow » Thu Dec 22, 2005 3:24 pm

I don't want to be snotty, but to the person who was complaining about the lighting on TV shows being so dark that you can't see what is going on...obviously you must have watched Buffy or you wouldn't be posting here...Hello!! Every time I watch the DVD's I have to turn up the brightness on my TV cuz I can't see the actors half the time otherwise...especially seems to happen on Willow and Tara after dark snuggly scenes...hmmmmmmmmmmm
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby Hemiola » Fri Dec 23, 2005 7:53 am

Yup, it was indeed Buffy (along with several other series) that set me off and inspired me to start this thread. :eyebrow

At least on "How I Met Your Mother" you can see everything, especially our beloved AH. :-D
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Re: A complaint.....

Postby sam7777 » Fri Feb 24, 2006 2:35 pm

Another round of MPAA attacks:
Huge Anti-Piracy Push By MPAA
In all, nine indexing sites have been targeted (Isohunt.com, BTHub.com and TorrentBox.com all owned by one individual.) BitTorrent: ISOHunt, TorrentSpy, NiteShadow.com, BTHub.com and TorrentBox.com; eDonkey2000: Ed2k-It.com; Newsgroups: NZB-Zone.com, BinNews.com and DVDRs.net.

The Razorback2 network, an eDonkey indexing server, was also shut down recently. One difference this go around is the targetting of Usenet servers:
MPAA targets Usenet - files lawsuit against news servers
Well, we knew this was coming! Certainly, it took longer than expected. Those that use news groups as a source of binaries know that there is a lot of content uploaded daily. Right now, there does not seem to be any sort of filtering going on. If you can imagine it, you can probably find it on Usenet. One of the neatest things about news servers is that it seems you can find very rare or out of print music. This could come to a halt, especially if the servers are located in countries where the laws prohibit the hosting of copyrighted files. Even though the RIAA has not jumped on the bandwagon yet, they could.

Lawsuits were filed Thursday against: BinNews.com, Torrentspy.com, IsoHunt, BTHub.com, TorrentBox.com, NiteShadow.com, Ed2k-It.com, NZB-Zone.com, and DVDRs.net. The suits mark the first time the MPAA has gone after Usenet, which has largely been spared in the crackdown on illicit file sharing.

Unlike P2P networks, which facilitate content swapping between users, Usenet operators host the content directly on their servers. However, because they do not regulate what files get uploaded, such companies have thus far avoided legal attacks through protections offered to Internet service providers.

Certainly other will spring up in their place but that will just make the MPAA sue indivualas as the RIAA has done.
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