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The Trans Thread

The place for kittens to discuss GLBT (gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered) issues as well as topics that don't fit in the other forums. (Some topics are off-topic in every forum on the board. Please read the FAQs.)

apparently the kitten is for ranting.

Postby sprhrgrl » Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:21 am

i'm looking into getting my name legally changed. my situation is that my parents are divorced. i've told my mother about nameness and genderqueerness and it's great. i've told my father to the extent that he knows of the name's existance - he's wandered off to a website which he knows i am a part of, and he has seen it on my door at school. he knows it's a handle i use, but he doesn't know the importance of it. also, i told my mother not too long after i started using this name. with him it's much more recent.



the name change is becoming more and more of a necessity for my identity to be validated. it's something that i use in all realms of life except for with my family, and i've been working there with my mother. her side of the family i feel fairly okay approaching about it all, but my father and his side. . . let's just say that it took me two years longer to come out to them as queer, and then three or so years after that is the first time i've had any acknowledgement of it. they just take a while.



i'm trying to figure out how to tell them about my name change, and if i want to even bother opening up a discussion of gender with them. i don't know how many of them actually need to know - this is why i didn't really come out as queer to anyone but my parents - but at the same time it seems like maybe offering my gender identity as a reason for why i'm changing my name will help them to see it as a more solid thing, rather than just some college whim.



this is a hard thing because i'm not technically in a transition of any sort, other than labelwise. i don't expect my family or much of the world to understand my pronouns. the only reason i even want to bring the name change up to the family is for legal documents and such. otherwise i would resign myself to going back to being oldname the dyke for family occasions.



have any of you gone through with this - either telling and not mentioning gender identity, or telling with gender identity? my partner suggested that i write a letter, but i don't even know how that would go. . . i'm just so scared.



have any of you gone through or witnessed anything like this before? i'm sorry my job today is to bring up old threads and whine at you in them. i'm just looking for a diversity of advice, and talking to my clique of white female-bodied genderqueer college students isn't doing it for me, even if they might be the ones who could most easily identify with my situation. . .

Sweetie, I'm a fag. I been there. - Tara (Dead Things shooting script)

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Re: apparently the kitten is for ranting.

Postby Gatito Grande » Tue Jul 20, 2004 12:59 pm

:kiss , sprhrgrl



Quote:
this is a hard thing because i'm not technically in a transition of any sort, other than labelwise.




That strikes me as *plenty* of a transition! (I don't think there's a single area related to being TG that I am not undecided on, inc. labels and my frickin' name. So if you know what you want there, you're way ahead of me!) Cut yourself some slack---this IS a Big Deal, and it's natural to be ranting and kvetching about it.



Quote:
my partner suggested that i write a letter, but i don't even know how that would go. . . i'm just so scared.




{{{sprhrgrl}}}



The Fear: know all about it. Live there constantly. :sigh



Letter-writing works well, I've heard, for many TG persons. If you go to one of the many webrings (like this one, for example), you can probably see some of these types of letters. The only person I've ever written in this way, was my best friend (who lives on the other side of the country from me now). She was supportive, but not especially curious about it (like you, my transition---such as it was---was not especially visible, in any kind of permanent way). That was OK by me, but others might be expecting some more definitive reaction to such a letter: just be forewarned of a variety of responses (or non-responses).



I wish I could tell you more, but basically exhausts my "wealth of experience" {snort!}. Will say more on the Sex Eth thread! :grin



GG Garfield? Tabby? Anyone else can help? Out



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Re: apparently the kitten is for ranting.

Postby Tempest Duer » Tue Jul 20, 2004 11:37 pm

Hmm... I'm glad this thread isn't still dead, and Dork Boy can't really give advice, because I'm still closeted! But personally, I'd say fuck them and get the name-change. But that's me with my hot temper speaking.

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Re: apparently the kitten is for ranting.

Postby Warduke » Mon Aug 09, 2004 9:41 pm

I read this at IMDb...



Quote:
Spacek and Cumming Have Transsexual Sex



Oscar-winning actress Sissy Spacek and co-star Alan Cumming have transsexual sex in a controversial new movie. In Southern Comfort - not related to Walter Hill's classic 1981 film of the same name - the 54-year-old actress plays Robert Eads, a female-to-male transsexual who falls for Lola Cola, a male-to-female transsexual, played by Cumming. Carrie star Spacek, who wears a prosthetic nose and a beard in the movie, is delighted with her new role, reports website Pagesix.Com. She says, "I'm thrilled, but it's going to be hard. I'll do the best I can. If I go down in flames, I can throw away all of my men's clothes." X-Men star Cumming, is equally enthusiastic: "It's such an amazing, tender love story, and a great challenge. We've got to do sex."



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Re: apparently the kitten is for ranting.

Postby maudmac » Mon Aug 09, 2004 10:28 pm

That's a true story. Here's a bit about the documentary:

Quote:
Southern Comfort (2001)



Documentary



1 hr. 30 min.



For her film SOUTHERN COMFORT, veteran documentarian Kate Davis found a rare subject in Robert Eads, a 52-year-old female-to-male transsexual living in Tuccoa, Georgia. Eads, a charming, laconic cowboy apparently "male" enough to once be propositioned to join the Ku Klux Klan, began life as a female, married, had two sons, and lived as a lesbian before finally transitioning into the heterosexual man that he always felt he really was. In a bitter irony, however, Eads died of cervical and ovarian cancer--betrayed, as he puts it, by the last part of himself that was still female.



Davis follows the last year in Eads's life, a momentous one in which he falls in love with Lola Cola (a male-to-female trans) and says goodbye to the adopted family of transsexuals whom he has sheperded for years. And he lives long enough to attend one final convention of Southern Comfort, an organization of about 500 transsexuals from around the South. Davis never gets on a soapbox; in fact, she's entirely unobstrusive, since she had to eschew funding (time was short already when she met Eads) and shoot the entire film herself on digital video. Her subjects, meanwhile, challenge endless stereotypes--they're self-proclaimed "trailer trash" who are nevertheless forging a new culture of gender.



Release Date: January 19, 2001 Sundance '01.



MPAA Rating: Not Rated.



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Southern Comfort

Postby Gatito Grande » Mon Aug 09, 2004 11:53 pm

I didn't meet Robert at True Spirit in '99---I think he was already too ill to travel by then---but his "presence" was there nonetheless (he was legendary). For some reason, I think maybe Lola was there, but I could be mistaken (True Spirit is an annual FTM conference, but a large number of MTFs also attend---only some looking to score! ;) )



It could be tricky, but I *think* Sissy could pull this off (she's already got the Southern part down, natch!). {Picturing her w/ Eads' ever-present pipe in his mouth}



GG Of course, she could take T to make her portrayal more convincing---that might be going a little too "DeNiro" though! :p Out

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You mean there's *another* set of ID twins, one F, one FTM?

Postby Gatito Grande » Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:00 am

I vaguely heard this promo during Lost tonight (I was out of the room): "Next 20/20: identical twins, born girls, are now brother and sister!"



I thought, oh, that must be Ryan (nee Rachel) and Renee, featured on the Discovery Health Channel's "Changing Sexes: Female-to-Male" (which is being re-run yet again, tomorrow---Thursday)



But no! Turns out it's another set of F&F to F&FTM twins!



Quote:
Coming Up on 2020

This Friday on 20/20 at 10 p.m. ET





Liana and Juan Barbachano are showing the world that in some cases twins couldn't be more different. They were born identical female twins. Now, they're sister and brother.




from ABC.go.com



GG DNA ain't everything! :grin Out



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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Gatito Grande » Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:36 pm

OK, I interrupt the bubble-bath I was about to throw myself into, because I am so pissed off. :rage

Now, don't get me wrong: I am in no way in favor of fraud, w/ $$$$ dedicated to hurricane-relief.

But some *sswipe Congressman, on the floor of the House of Representatives, was just going through a long laundry-list of "fraud paid for w/ Katrina-relief money".

And how did he finish his stem-winder?

He concluded (after talking about Hawaiian vacations, and Girls Gone Wild videos, and divorce-lawyer payments, etc. etc. etc. etc.):

"....and, if you can believe this, SEX CHANGE SURGERY!!!!"


Like this was the worst, most ridiculous, most disgusting thing in ALL THE WORLD. :shock

GG Bite my TG ass, muthaf*cka! :fit2 Out
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby umgaynow » Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:00 pm

Don't people like that make you want to send over Lorena Bobbit to them for a little of her style of "gender re-assignment" surgery?

To lump it in with Girls Gone Wild like it is some sort of kinky sex trip rather than in so many cases a life saving surgery...I know my friend Kate would have killed herself if she hadn't been able to get the surgery finally...ignorant people make me question my pacifism sometimes!!

Incidentally, judging by her photo, there is quite a remarkable resemblance between my friend Kate and FemaleOfTheSpecies...same lovely red hair and creamy skin


And to the kitten who was talking about the name change...I think if Penn Gilette can name his daughter Moxie Crimefighter...you ought to be able to legally change yours to any damn thing you want! Give 'em hell!
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby MagicPancakes » Thu Jun 15, 2006 9:58 am

i saw the same segment on the local news and it pissed me off....people were blowing money on porn and alcohol but everyone is more outraged about someone getting a necessary operation. what a country.

no one stopped to put themselves in that person's shoes...an operation that would save their life, actually GIVE them the life they always felt they were denied, that was always impossible for financial reasons....then one day, BOOM, their house is gone, everything in their life that brought some small sense of comfort and security in a world that was otherwise bleak because they could never feel at home in their own skin...and as a result they get this chance to actually have their operation and turn a horrific situation/event into something postive, something to make their life finally complete...

ok im done, it just really pisses me off when people can't take five seconds to walk in someone else's shoes.
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Gatito Grande » Thu Jun 15, 2006 10:19 am

Well, this thread having been dormant so long, I'm relieved that people here understand.

in so many cases a life saving surgery


That's it exactly, umgaynow.

Could you imagine this Congressman (I think it was Charles Dent---brace yourself, a Republican :stink), finishing his speech "...even, if you can believe this, a KIDNEY TRANSPLANT!!!!" (because somehow, I can't imagine the latter :happy)

GG And perhaps even sadder, was how not only the mainstream media, but even some progressive organizations and bloggers, were picking up on this same sensationalism. I spent yesterday afternoon writing a number of angry emails and comments to people who should have known better :gnome Out

(Including one civil rights organization, that included "GLBT" under their umbrella: they were disseminating the same insensitive AP headline "Sex Change!" story, on their news page! :shock)
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby maudmac » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:12 pm

Oh. My. God. This is such bullshit!!!

City official faces firing over sex change plan

3:42 p.m. EST, February 28, 2007

LARGO, Florida (AP) -- The City Commission voted to begin the process of firing a top official less than a week after he announced plans to pursue a sex-change operation.

The 5-to-2 vote Tuesday started a three-step process to remove City Manager Steve Stanton from the job he's held for 14 years.

Stanton, 48, confirmed last week that he is a transsexual. With a solid reputation as a forceful and energetic leader, he had hoped to keep his $140,000-a-year job as he underwent the gender reassignment process.

"It's just painful to know seven days ago I was a good guy and now ... I have no integrity," Stanton told the commission. "My challenge here has always been that someday I was going to leave this organization. So I am going to do it with a smile on my face."

Stanton can appeal the decision, though his contract says he can be fired without cause at any time.

He will be placed on paid leave while the city begins the legal process to end his contract. The council must vote again to formally fire him.

Mayor Patricia Gerard and Commissioner Rodney Woods cast the dissenting votes.

"He's done a great job for us," Gerard said. "He's done what we asked him to do and taken the heat over and over and over again and now we're going to turn on him."

Commissioner Mary Gray Black said Stanton's surprise announcement last week "caused stress, turmoil, distraction and work disruption" among other city employees.

"I do not feel he has the integrity, nor the trust, nor the respect, nor the confidence to continue as the city manager of the city of Largo," said Black, who introduced a resolution to fire Stanton on Monday.

About 500 people attended the meeting. Dozens signed up to speak, some praising Stanton and others saying the exposure of his secret life undermined his ability to lead the city.

City officials say they have received hundreds of e-mails about Stanton's announcement, most calling for his removal.

Largo is a city of about 76,000 about 22 miles west of Tampa.
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Boschi » Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:03 am

I just spend last night talking to my gf about how frustrating it is to put yourself out into the world and try to do good things, facing the knowledge that it may not work, or be appreciated, respected or valued.

And that, after years of trying, and even years of succeeding, at moving things forward in the world and helping people, you can still be left high and dry. Life doesn't necessarily reward honesty or good work - for anyone.

I post this thought in response to the article in the previous post, particularly the comments which state

1) that Stanton had done his job well and had "taken the heat"

and

2) that the idiot who introduced the resolution to fire him said "I do not feel he has the integrity, nor the trust, nor the respect, nor the confidence to continue as the city manager of the city of Largo"

I'm someone who tends to believe that the proof is in the pudding. You do good work, and you can rest on that reputation. I down play my sexuality (not trans, lesbian) sometimes because I want a reputation based on my acts and choices, and I consider my sexuality simply a part of me. I'm not closeted, but as a rule I want my sexuality to be the second or third thing that people identify with me.

I am reminded lately, over and over again, that this is naive of me. Easy, too, because despite "reading" lesbian to many lesbians, I pass pretty easily with straight folk. I stand out for looking like a blue collar, outdoor working woman, but for some reason people find this interesting, not threatening.

At anyrate, the point I'm trying to get to here is that I have a tremendous amount of respect for people like Stanton, who carry themselves, with dignity and honesty, well past others comfort levels without apology.

He is being denied the credit, security and reputation that his years of service are worth. The city is losing out. He is losing out.

What I want to say to everyone out there who is in similar situations is to thank you for continuing to put out good things in to a world that may kick the shit out of you, discredit you, and leave you high and dry.

The appreciation of strangers isn't enough, I realize. Doesn't pay the bills, provide a home, protect your family or open up career and life options to you. Laws, policy and public opinion needs to change to do that when your queerness presents obstacles. And I'm up for working at that.

In the meantime however, thank you. I believe there is something inherently good in the work itself. And I derive pleasure and security from knowing that there are people out there working, professionally and responsibly, because it is the right thing to do. It's life, ya know?

Allrighty, ending my corny, trite, sophomoric sermon....

Hope it's okay that I posted this in this thread, I know it is non-trans specific.
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Willowtree252 » Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:44 am

:pinky Why can,t people just let other people be who thay are you may not like it or them BUT respect them if someone wants to change there sex I say good for you live life to its fullest and be happy. :-|
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby umgaynow » Fri Mar 02, 2007 1:55 pm

Dianneswillowtree wrote::pinky Why can,t people just let other people be who thay are you may not like it or them BUT respect them if someone wants to change there sex I say good for you live life to its fullest and be happy.


Not criticizing you at all Ms Tree...just something in your post jumped out at me...it's the nomenclature "sex change"...from all I have heard from transgender people I have known this is really a misnomer...it gives people the wrong idea I think...same goes for "gender reassignment surgery"...what it really ought to be called is "gender corrective surgery" because for the people who need it that is what it is...they feel they were born into the wrong body...like a birth defect...I think the common terms of "sex change" and "gender reassignment" kind of lend an aura of capricious choice to the matter...something that is soooooo far from the truth...if only we could make people at large understand the truth of the situation...then again, quite a large number of the common folk can't understand that sexual orientation isn't a choice...so I suppose that plain ordinary compassion and understanding is too much to ask...to quote one of my fave BTVS characters...This world's no fun

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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby urnofosiris » Fri Mar 02, 2007 4:13 pm

Well said umgaynow, terminology can be misleading. Anyway, it´s a good thing that there are people like the honorable trustworthy respectable lily white Mary Gray Black defending the integrity of the great US democracy and the rest of the world for that matter. If not for people like her all that gender bending would stop the earth from turning, make the sun blow up and the universe implode.
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby maudmac » Sat Apr 21, 2007 4:58 pm

Look what those gender benders are up to now - girls running for prom king! Image What is the world coming to?!?

'Transgender' candidate on prom king ballot

FRESNO, California (AP) -- When school officials announce the name of the Fresno High School prom king on Saturday, Cinthia Covarrubias will be wearing a tuxedo just like the six boys vying for the honor.

Administrators agreed to reverse a district protocol this week that limited males to compete for the title after Covarrubias was nominated by her classmates.

"I would never have run for anything if I had to wear a dress," said Covarrubias, who considers herself transgender, an umbrella term that covers people whose outward appearance and internal identity don't match their gender at birth.

Gay youth advocates called it a landmark victory for campus gender expression and said they believe it's the first time in the United States that an openly transgender student has run for prom royalty.


That's kind of a wonky definition of "transgender" isn't it?

Follow the above link to read the rest of the article.

Best quote from a student: "We live in a generation now where dudes are chicks and chicks are dudes."

True dat.
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Gatito Grande » Mon Apr 30, 2007 10:59 pm

transgender, an umbrella term that covers people whose outward appearance and internal identity don't match their gender at birth.


???

I don't see the wonkiness, Holley.

I mean, I can imagine many female-identified females (aka "girls" or "women") who would ALSO enjoy wearing a tux, and running for prom king (i.e., that that, in itself, wouldn't make one tg). But if Cinthia/Tony says ze ("hu"---that's another gender-neutral pronoun I've been seeing lately) IS trans, that's all that really matters.

GG As always---YMMV! :peace Out
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby maudmac » Tue May 01, 2007 12:28 am

Of course, if the person in question self-identifies as trans, that's good enough for me, too. And, I agree, women engaging in stereotypically masculine behaviors or men engaging in stereotypically feminine behaviors need not be seen as evidence of transgenderism. I have no issue with Cinthia/Tony's self-identification.

My issue is with the article's definition of what it means to be transgender. The article defines trans as "people whose outward appearance and internal identity don't match their gender at birth" and that's what I find wonky. Their outward appearance and internal identity likely do match their gender. I think the author of the article is assuming the terms "sex" and "gender" are interchangeable. Or is leaving out the idea that their identity isn't in line with stereotypical gender roles associated with their biological sex, or something along those lines.

I think, for the purposes of an article at cnn.com, it would be too much for them to go into some huge analysis of sex and gender, as not only are both sex and gender a lot more ambiguous and/or fluid than the average reader probably thinks, but even within the community, there is disagreement about definitions of specific terms. But I don't think it's too much to ask that they make a distinction between what's meant by "sex" and what's meant by "gender."

PS - GG, I thought you were dead! Good to have you back. Interesting discussion.
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Leaf » Wed May 30, 2007 12:35 pm

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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby maudmac » Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:44 pm

This is really interesting. From cnn.com:
Convicted killer's bid for sex change draws big costs

BOSTON (AP) -- A trial that opened more than a year ago has become bogged down in Boston federal court.

There have been hundreds of hours of testimony from witnesses, including 10 medical specialists paid tens of thousands of dollars. The judge himself even hired an expert to help him make sense of it all.

The question at the center of the case: Should a murderer serving life in prison get a sex-change operation at taxpayer expense?

The case of Michelle -- formerly Robert -- Kosilek is being closely watched across the country by advocates for other inmates who want to undergo a sex change. Transgender inmates in other states have sued prison officials, and not one has succeeded in persuading a judge to order a sex-change operation.

The Massachusetts Correction Department is vigorously fighting Kosilek's request for surgery, saying it would create a security nightmare and make Kosilek a target for sexual assault.

An Associated Press review of the case, including figures obtained through Freedom of Information Act requests and interviews, found that the Correction Department and its outside health care provider have spent more than $52,000 on experts to testify about an operation that would cost about $20,000.

The duration and expense of the case have outraged some lawmakers who insist that taxpayers should not have to pay for inmates to have surgery that most private insurers reject as elective.

"They are prisoners. They are there because they've broken the law," said Republican state Sen. Scott Brown, who unsuccessfully introduced a bill to ban sex-change surgery for inmates. "Other folks, people who want to get these types of surgeries, they have to go through their insurance carrier or save up for it and do it independently. Yet if you are in prison, you can do it for nothing? That doesn't make a lot of sense."
Advocates call surgery a medical necessity

But advocates say in some cases -- such as that of Kosilek, who has twice attempted suicide -- sex-change surgery is as much a medical necessity as treatment for diabetes or high blood pressure.

"The duty belongs to the prison to figure out how to fulfill its constitutional obligations to both provide adequate medical care and provide a fundamental security for all inmates," said Cole Thaler, an attorney with Lambda Legal, a gay- and transgender-rights group.

Kosilek, 58, was convicted of strangling his wife in 1990. He claimed he killed her in self-defense after she spilled boiling tea on his genitals.

Robert Kosilek legally changed his name to Michelle in 1993, and has sued the Correction Department twice, arguing that its refusal to allow a sex-change operation violates the Eighth Amendment protection against cruel and unusual punishment.

In 2002, U.S. District Judge Mark Wolf ruled that Kosilek was entitled to medical treatment for gender identity disorder, but stopped short of ordering the surgery. Kosilek sued again in 2005, arguing that the hormone treatments, laser hair removal and psychotherapy she has received since Wolf's ruling have not relieved her anxiety and depression.

"I would not want to continue existing like this," Kosilek testified.

Kosilek's second trial, which began in May 2006, has featured expert testimony from 10 doctors, psychiatrists and psychotherapists. Wolf has not indicated when he will rule.
Experts offer up differing opinions

The Correction Department has spent about $33,000 on two experts it retained to evaluate Kosilek. Both Cynthia Osborne, a Baltimore psychotherapist, and Chester Schmidt, a psychiatry professor at Johns Hopkins University, said Kosilek does not need the surgery. Schmidt's fee alone was $350 per hour.

Two other doctors retained and paid for by the department's outside health provider, the University of Massachusetts Correctional Health Program, at a cost of just under $19,000 said they believe the surgery is medically necessary for Kosilek. Two other doctors who work for the health provider agreed with that.

In addition, two psychiatrists who testified for Kosilek recommended the surgery. A Boston law firm representing Kosilek for free paid for those experts but would not disclose the cost.

In Wisconsin, five inmates sued after the Legislature passed a law that bars Correction Department funding for hormone treatments or sex-change surgery. The case is expected to go to trial in October.

Those who argue against allowing the surgery say it could open the floodgates to other inmates who want sex-change operations or other treatments considered elective.

In Massachusetts, 10 inmates have been diagnosed with gender identity disorder and are receiving hormone treatments. Two other inmates besides Kosilek have asked for sex-change surgery.

Corrections officials say their decision to deny the surgery has nothing to do with costs or the politics of crime. They cite the testimony of their experts and Kosilek herself that her feelings of depression have diminished since she began taking hormones.

Former Commissioner Kathleen Dennehy testified that allowing Kosilek to complete the transformation into a woman would present a security problem. Whether she stays in a male prison or is transferred to a female prison, she could become a target for sexual assault, Dennehy testified.

Dennehy also said prison officials cannot be influenced by Kosilek's talk of suicide.

"The department does not negotiate or respond to threats of harm or suicide in an effort to barter," she said. "You couldn't run a prison with that kind of leveraging going on."


How tragic that they've spent way more fighting it than the surgery would have cost.

Seems the essence of the issue here is whether reassignment surgery is truly elective or a necessity. If elective, no, prisons shouldn't pay for the procedure. If a medical necessity, yes, prisons must pay for it. Good luck making that determination, as you will always be able to bring in just as many experts on either side who will argue just as strongly for each. Which will just leave it up to one judge's opinion - a judge you can only hope will be impartial.

I think the best solution to this problem would be to evaluate each instance on a case-by-case basis, with no policy to always deny or grant requests for surgery - just like it is on the outside.

I expect the general public will always view this surgery as elective and it will always rub the taxpayers the wrong way to have to pay for it, especially so because the patients are convicted of crimes. But the taxpayers are already paying for other treatments short of the surgery, thanks to the status of Gender Identity Disorder as a pathology. Why not follow it all the way to surgery, then?

I'm not sure I buy the objection that it would "create a security nightmare and make Kosilek a target for sexual assault." How in the world is she not a target for sexual assault right now? Any incarcerated person is a target for sexual assault. It isn't as if there's little or no rape in prisons now. As for whether Kosilek should be in a men's prison or a women's prison, I'm inclined to think it less problematic overall for her to be in a women's prison. I really don't see what the big deal is. Granted, not all women's prisons are Camp Cupcake where everyone braids each other's hair and the worst thing that can happen is someone spreads nasty rumors about you. Women's prisons can be horrifying, but I still think Kosilek would be better off there.
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Ms. Moderator Fantastico
 
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Re: The Trans Thread

Postby Gatito Grande » Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:21 pm

Holley, I wonder if you haven't identified a "silent partner" (friend of the court) in all this, when you say

Seems the essence of the issue here is whether reassignment surgery is truly elective or a necessity


and all the talk about "floodgates."

There just aren't THAT many TG prisoners, so I really don't think that's the flood feared.

It's the flood outside of prisons . . . and that insurance companies don't want to get hit with it! :shy

It's the insurance companies, more than the prison administrators, are AFRAID of a policy shift that says this surgery is essential, not elective.

GG Look at those legislative efforts (to ban SRS---even hormones!---in prisons): like we don't know legislators are in the pockets of the insurance companies??? :happy Out

While these stories seem focused on MTFs, I think FTMs would have an even scarier time of it: if they were sent to men's prisons, they really COULD be a more likely target for rape! :paranoid
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Gatito Grande
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