The Harry Potter Book Thread

[urnofosiris]

I just finished the book!! I so don't know how to use the spoilers hiders!!

It has been very kind that people have used spoiler codes so far, but it can´t be kept up forever if we are to really discuss this book freely. Anyone who enters this thread does so at the risk of being spoiled. The book has been out for almost a week, it is well known that a lot of people made sure to be first in line and read it in a matter of days. I avoided this thread myself till I finished. I plan on commenting later. Anyone who wants to post without using spoilers space or spoilercode can do so. Anyone who reads beyond this post definitely does so at the peril of being spoiled when it comes to part 6.

[supertramp]

*Ahem* I can't believe that Snape killed Dumbledore - that bitch!

Although I think that Dumbledore told him to do it. I mean, as soon as Harry and he came to the tower, Dumbledore sent for Snape, so when Snape came up behind the Death Eaters Dumbledore had no reason to believe he was there for any reason other than to help him so why would he plead with him? I think he was imploring Snape to kill him, for some unknown reason. Perhaps only Snape can do something that Dumbledore can not to help Harry.

It took me a while to come up with that theory - it came after the "Snape is just a big fat shitweasel" and "Narcissa or Bellatrix had Snape under the imperius curse" theories.

[Marguerite]

well I'm still thinking Snape is a nice guy ( in a way) if Dumbledore trusted him I trust him, I would just like to know why! I am so mad they killed Dumbledore, if J K Rowling kills Ron then all my favorite characters will have died!! and I think the story with him and Hermione is so cute but Im not sure I understood, are they together now or not? and Im so mad at Harry for telling Ginny they can't be together stupid him! Voldemort will try to kill everybody he knows anyway so! what is sad is that there is only one book left to the serie! and we will have to wait a lot for the next book!! and well I was quoted in this thread woohoo I feel like Im famous nah really its just funny, and all that because of my ignorance! well! bye Marguerite

[urnofosiris]

I was there when the bookstore opened saturdaymorning and bought it right away. I finished it by tuesday. Loved it from the first word till the last.

Right up until Harry and Dumbledore went after that Horcrux I had forgotten all about someone dying in this part. I was enjoying the book so much, really enjoying the fact that Harry was not being an annoying snot (finally growing up and trusting his friends and Dumbledore enough to not hide anything from them), really enjoying the fact that he was not confronting yet another incarnation of Voldemort, really enjoying getting to know more about the past in a reasonably angst free manner. Then I remembered someone was going to die, I worried it would Dumbledore as soon as they entered that cave.

I still can hardly believe it actually happened. The manner in which it happened puzzles and sort of shocked me. I only half get why he immobilized Harry, it was quite a risk, what if someone had bumped into Harry? He would have been defenseless. Why didn´t he do it to whoever was going to enter? Why would he plead with Snape even if he realized he had turned on him? He was such a proud man, unafraid to lay down his life for Harry and their cause. The pleading tone in his voice must have been torture for Harry, he must have known that, surely he would spare him that, his death would have been more than bad enough.

Despite all that happened I still cannot believe Snape is the evil guy he is made out to be. That first chapter did not make me think otherwise and neither does the death of Dumbledore. I can´t believe Dumbledore would plead, I can´t believe Snape killed him because of that unbreakable vow or because he really is a Death Eater. Dumbledore was so adamant and unwavering in his trust. So he can make mistakes, but I am still not ready to believe his faith in Snape was a mistake. This must serve some purpose.

Anyway, I loved Ginny in this book. The way JK Rowling described Harry´s feelings was hilarious at times (like the jealous beast in his chest sniffing the air hopefully) and very recognizable. I like them as a pair. Ginny is quite feisty, she is good for him and Harry to me finally has grown into a guy who is good enough for her. His ´we can´t be together´ bit seems a tad naieve. It is not as if not being together will make her any more safe from harm, but I don´t believe that resolution will last long anyway. I liked the Ron/Hermione interaction as well. JK Rowling does a great job at making these characters come to life. They are not just running around saving the world, they are also growing up, feeling the things we all felt and feel.

I do not want to wait two years for the last part, but at the same time I don´t want the story to end yet. I hope the final part will be a long one, a very long one.

[robotguru]

I think Snape killing Dumbledore was partly because of the Unbreakable vow, but i also think that it is to benefit Harry.

Harry will not learn from Snape as an ally, the Occulemency lessons showed that plainly, and though Harry riled Snape with the coward bit, that was the only time that Snape lost his cool.

But think about it, ok, so Snape could not have engineered Harry getting his book, but through that, he's already taught him so much, and in that fight, he did indeed tell Harry that he would need to keep with the none verbal comands and close his mind. Harry is going to fight Snape, Harry will probably kill him, but he will learn what he needs to to kill Voldemort and that is the important factor.

I think Malfoy still has a key part to play, Voldemort will be looking for him to prove himself after failing to kill Dumbledore himself and he will clash with Harry once more.

As for the Harry and Ginny thing, from what i gather, Harry, Ron and Hermione will spend two weeks at the Dursley's, and remember that Ron and Hermione are of age *evil grin* in case they should try and mistreat them, then they go to The Burrow. I don't think that Harry and Ginny will conciously try and further their relationship, Harry ended it and Ginny understood from what we read, but they didn't consciously start it either.

The best thing about this i think, these characters are not infallible, they make mistakes, they have been growing up and going through the whole range of emotions and attitudes, they are real. The last book is going to be interesting, Harry is indeed Dumbledore's man through and through (and that was one of my fave lines, i might add) and he is going to avenge Dumbledore or die in the process.

[Jennpurr]

My dad just surprised me when I got home from work. He handed me this book! He bought it for me!! I don't know when I will actually get the chance to read it. I need to read, "The Goblet of Fire," and, "Order of the Pheonix." I bought, "The Prisoner of Azkaban," back when the movie came out and I still haven't read it. Hee...

Anyway...

Does anyone know or is anyone willing to tell me if Dobby will be in any of the movies coming up? I missed him not being in TPoA.

Thanks in advance,

Jen

[idontlikejam]

i too thought snape was on dumbledores side till up to when he actually killed him

anyway i really liked this one, finally it feels like we know everything and stuffs not being held back anymore.
glad to see the ginny and harry thing and ron and hermione thing are finally coming to pass cus been waiting for that for ever.
thought the whole horcrux/immortality thing was excellent.

plus it really ended exactly how i hoped it would

[GayNow]

I keep thinking of Dumbledore making Harry promise to do ANYTHING he asked....without question. I'm thinking there is a good possibility that Dumbledore did the same with Snape. Dumbledore was a brilliant man...not just a brilliant wizard. And he had an innate sense of people's true natures. So, I have faith in Dumbledore's faith in Severus. I believe Dumbledore saying "Please Severus" wasn't a plea for his life or for his life to be ended quickly...I think it was a plea for Severus to put personal feelings for Dumbledore aside and stay true to the fight agaist Voldemort.

Just my two cents.

Carleen

[Tara22]

I just finished the book and I have to say that I could not put it down. That woman is a plot genius. Everything that you think you know and understand from previous books and chapters just keeps twisting around until the reality is something you couldn't even have imagined.

I honestly don't know about Snape. I have swapped between believing in him and hating him throughout the whole series. I do agree that there are a lot of facts that make it look like he is a traitor. I would love to believe that he is but Dumbledore was so set in his ways about him that I just don't know. I do know one thing for sure, next book will be bloody fantastic!

I really loved the dynamic between Harry and Dumbledore in this one. Harry's loyalty towards him and Dumbledore's evident love and respect in return. Oh how the end broke my heart!

I have a theory about R.A.B and don't ask me why, but I just do. I think it is Regulus Black, Sirius's brother. I have very few reasons I could write down here, as I said it is really just a huge hunch, but Regulus knew Voldemort, in fact, he served him, and JK mentioned him earlier in the book (in passing, but very often that is her way of dropping character names.)

As for the couplings in this book, I have always been a Ron/Hermione shipper so I was elated to see a relationship start to form. Also, from very early on (book three?) I have warmed to the idea of Ginny and Harry together. Of course, I shook it off telling myself that it'd never happen (you threw me off with the Cho thing, JK!) but when it did I was grinning wider than the Cheshire cat. I do not know what will happen next book. It will be painful to wait for it. I am sure of that. I don't think I will be hypothesising about who will die when because I really don't want to know!

Perhaps I am nuts but I am such an obsessive fan of this series that I feel as if I know the characters personally, much like I feel about Willow and Tara.

Bring on the next one!

*sighs*

Kudos JK, Kudos.

[Puff]

I just finished the book last night, it took me a few days longer because I had to wait for it to arrive from the UK. Anyway, I didn't know there was going to be a character death so it came as a bit of a shock. Won't it make a jolly movie? I can just picture all of the children (and adults) sobbing in their seats.

I love the Hermione/Ron relationship I don't know who wrote that fighting does not mean that they will get together LOL sorry it does in teenage fiction. I also predicted back in book two that Ginny and Harry would get together although I disagree with Harry breaking up with Ginny at the end...not that I think she will accept it, escpecially if Hermione has a few words to her too. In fact Draco knows that Ginny and Harry are together (not spilt up) so he will tell Voldemort that and she will still be in danger.

Is Snape the best double agent ever or is he just a bloody traitor? Only time will tell. Maybe Dumbledore was under a curse? He did do that whole question and answer thing about his favorite jam at the beginning. Either way I am sure that Snapes days are numbered now even if he is the half blood prince.

Neville and Luna. Now that's just sweet.

Tonks and Lupin. Not a bad match and I like Lupin I think he rocks.

Bill and Fleur. Well I admit I thought she would leave him with his face scarred but good for her. She was annoying though.

I am not sure how the seventh book will go, I will miss it being set at Hogwarts and am not sure what will happen there. I am sure that JK will take us on a wild journey though. There's a hell of a lot that needs to pass in the next one.

All in all book 6 was way better than book 5 IMH even though I will be lamenting the loss of Dumbledore with Fawkes.

[Kieli]

I love the Hermione/Ron relationship I don't know who wrote that fighting does not mean that they will get together LOL sorry it does in teenage fiction.

I said it and not ALL teenage fiction uses that tired cliche. One sincerely hopes that JK won't resort to it. It's too predictable and really, Ron and Hermione have nothing in common to make it a relationship worth following. That's just MHO. Harry and Hermione have intelligence, wit and resourcefulness that make them a perfect match. The Weasleys are too impulsive to be good mates for either of them, in my observation.

[urnofosiris]

I have a theory about R.A.B and don't ask me why, but I just do. I think it is Regulus Black, Sirius's brother. I have very few reasons I could write down here, as I said it is really just a huge hunch, but Regulus knew Voldemort, in fact, he served him, and JK mentioned him earlier in the book (in passing, but very often that is her way of dropping character names.)

Good call, and you are not the only one who thinks so, I cannot claim I had thought of it myself but it makes great sense. It has got to be a character that at least had gotten a mention before. I doubt it would be someone completely unheard of. I am going to reread all the books to kill the time till the last one and see what details I missed.
Was anyone really surprised Snape turned out to be the half blood prince? I can´t say that I was. My first thought was that it must be him when Harry got his hands on that potions book. Part 6 was named after it, but I am not sure I get the importance of this book and half blood prince business other than the short cut to the best potions Harry got from it.

edit: as for Ron/Hermione, they were a long time coming and I can see them working as a couple perfectly precisely because they are so different. JK Rowling commented on them in part two of an interview she gave to two of the online Harry Potter sites out there, it´s an interesting read, she is a fascinating woman all around:

http://www.mugglenet.com/jkrinterview2.shtml

[Kieli]

But Ron — I had a lot of fun with that in this book. I really enjoyed writing the Ron/Lavender business, and the reason that was enjoyable was Ron up to this point has been quite immature compared to the other two and he kind of needed to make himself worthy of Hermione. Now, that didn't mean necessarily physical experience but he had to grow up emotionally and now he's taken a big step up. Because he's had the meaningless physical experience - let’s face it, his emotions were never deeply engaged with Lavender -

(from the interview)...Honestly, I can't see what he's done to make her worthy of him. Ron is a good friend to Harry & Hermione, granted, but I never have and never will think of him as good enough stock for her. Too bad, really, that she took the obvious route. Would've been quite interested to see how the H/Hr pairing would've played out.

After reading the interview, I have to say I'm a bit put out with the interviewers viewing online fans as "delusional" or hinting that they're "militant". Don't bite the hand that feeds you, mate. Glad that JK had enough sense to be more tactful about her comments than the interviewers.

[urnofosiris]

Remember that the interviewers are online fans themselves. Takes one to know one I guess.
As for Ron/Hermione or Hermione/Harry. It is all subjective. To me it would have seemed obvious to pair Harry with Hermione. Ron has annoyed me throughout the books, but so has Harry. Hermione is in a league of her own as far as I´m concernced, but both Ron and Harry are honorable brave young men and as close to good enough for her as anyone can be, heh. I am not shipping anyone though, I basically like all the relationships that have come and gone so far. JK describes them and their feelings so well. That said, I was happy that Fleur and Bill are staying together. I like Fleur and she showed real character and proved she is more than a pretty face which is what I suspect is all that her in laws saw in her.

[Kieli]

Remember that the interviewers are online fans themselves. Takes one to know one I guess.

I suppose but my respect for JK has dimmed considerably since she pretty much seemed to be encouraging their unabashed flaming of other fandoms. Sounds pretty much like something that another certain person did to another certain fandom which caused quite a bit of backlash. Didn't do wonders for him either, if I recall correctly.

As for Ron/Hermione or Hermione/Harry. It is all subjective. To me it would have seemed obvious to pair Harry with Hermione. Ron has annoyed me throughout the books, but so has Harry. Hermione is in a league of her own as far as I´m concerned, but both Ron and Harry are honorable brave young men and as close to good enough for her as anyone can be, heh. I am not shipping anyone though, I basically like all the relationships that have come and gone so far. JK describes them and their feelings so well. That said, I was happy that Fleur and Bill are staying together. I like Fleur and she showed real character and proved she is more than a pretty face which is what I suspect is all that her in laws saw in her.

No doubt, JK has written an amazing series (that could do with some braver editors IMHO....some paring down is in order in a few places..) Fleur's character amazed me mostly because I was never very fond of her from start...but she did a good bit of maturing which helped me revise my opinions of her. Some of the characters haven't done so well with me in that regard and thus, my prior opinions remain firmly entrenched. *shrug* Some things I just can't buy, I guess.

[Jennpurr]

Does anyone know or is anyone willing to tell me if Dobby will be in any of the movies coming up? I missed him not being in TPoA.

Thanks in advance,

Jen

[GayNow]

Perhaps he'll be in GoF...I can't remember if it was GoF or OotP when Hermoine started S.P.E.W.

[Tara22]

Dobby should be back in 'The Goblet of Fire' because of the whole storyline with Winky (another house elf). If not, he is definitely in 'The Half Blood Prince' and Kreacher (a different house elf) will be in 'Order of the Pheonix', so there will be muchos elf appearences.

[Spighy]

http://www.dumbledoreisnotdead.com/

They have some interesting theories... definitely worth a look.

[urnofosiris]

I´ll read it when I am awake, heh, I am amused at the big spoiler warning. Very considerate, but whatever would someone think who comes across the webadress dubmbledoreisnotdead.com?

[Bagheera]

I have a theory about R.A.B and don't ask me why, but I just do. I think it is Regulus Black, Sirius's brother.

Completely agree. The text also says he died not very long after Voldemort's fall.

I have theory that connects with this: I think the message from RAB is a red herring. The bit of Voldemort hidden away in the cave (I believe) was actually the potion that Dumbledore drank. Once he'd drunk it, he had to die to kill that part of Voldemort's soul. It makes Dumbledore's behaviour during and afterwards make more sense (eg. his rantings and ravings while drinking the potion, and his urgent need to find Snape). He probably also knew about the geas Snape was under (to use an old ADnD term) and ensured Snape killed him to give Draco Malfoy and his father the chance to change sides.

Far-fetched or what?

[urnofosiris]

Oh I think that is absolutely brilliant. I bet JK Rowling herself would really appreciate that theory even if it does not turn out to be true. I think it actually makes such perfect sense that it should be true. It really should, indeed Dumbledore was very adamant that he absolutely had to see Snape and I cannot see him plead for any reason other than that he wanted Snape to kill him.

[WebWarlock]

See I figure that Dumbledore went to Snape because he also knew that Snape was the only one that could do it.

I am more than convinced now that there was some sort of agreement between Snape and Dumbledore, almost an Unbreakable Oath sort of agreement, that Snape would do this. I also get the feeling that Snape did not really want the agreement.

JKR is very good a setting a story up. Dumbledore's instructions to Harry were too precise. Was Snape given similar instructions once apon a time?

Hard to say, but she is sure setting us all up for a massive book 7!

Warlock

[FineyMcFine]

I totally agree that Snape is a good guy and there's some sort of Unbreakable Promise afoot that forced him to kill Dumbledore.

The hypothesis about the potion itself being a Horcrux is brilliant! Whether or not it ends up being true, it makes a lot of sense.

One thing that has been consistent throughout the books is Harry's animosity toward Snape. Now, having seen Snape murder Dumbledore, it will be harder than ever for Harry to see Snape as a good guy.

Dumbledore harped on the advantage Harry has over Voldemort being his ability to love and forgive, so I'm thinking that book 7 will require Harry to come to terms with Snape and drop his grudge and admit that Snape's a good guy. That will be very hard for Harry.

[urnofosiris]

He managed it for Peter Pettigrew, maybe not forgiving, but he did not let his desire for revenge take over. I really do hope Snape will turn out to be a good guy, JK Rowling has muddled everything so much that it could still easily go either way. Very interesting. Two years is too long a wait for the answers dammit. I will reread the books in the meantime because I have forgotten a few things already and there are the movies to keep me distracted as well. I recently rewatched the second and third part and enjoyed them more than on first viewing. I am already looking forward to seeing book six be made into a movie.

[DreamsToDream]

Okay, sorry if ive missed this somewhere on this thread or if its a really obvious answer in the book but i must have missed it. Why was Dumbledore's hand hurt?

[cosmic dancer]

The book does explain it, but not till nearish the end. Dumbledore had destroyed one of Voldemorts horcruxes (a ring I think) and it had a nasty curse or other spell on it. This caused the serious hand injury. Dumbledore does say though that without Snapes intervention he'd proably be dead.

This gives evidence for Snape working for the 'good' side, at that point in time at any rate. After all why would you save the life of someone you want dead, when your failure to treat him properly would allow him to die, possibly with no blame attached to you?

Dumbledore harped on the advantage Harry has over Voldemort being his ability to love and forgive, so I'm thinking that book 7 will require Harry to come to terms with Snape and drop his grudge and admit that Snape's a good guy. That will be very hard for Harry.

I agree with this. It wouldn't suprise me at all if despite all appearances to the contary Snape is still actually loyal to the 'good' side. How he'll ever convince Harry of that though I have no idea.

[Domaris]

For some reason I don't think Dumbledore's dead. I mean, come on, he's like the greatest sorcerer of his time and he'd get killed by SNAPE? Even though Snape is a powerful sorcerer? It simply doesn't make any sense to me.

When I was reading that part, I thought there was something wrong about how the Avada Kedevra (sp?) was described. After reading the dumbledoreisnotdead website, I noticed they thought exactly like me. Why would J.K. suddenly change the effect of the curse (in the previous book, the victim would just fall on the ground, dead. In this one, it's much more "tragic" and "dramatic" with Dumbledore "flying" and stuff).

And what's up with Trewlaney anyway?


I personally think it's all just a setup to get Harry to react and go after Voldemort.

[urnofosiris]

I am sure Dumbledore is dead, he was already slumped backwards against the parapet and the blast of the spell merely toppled him over. Of course it is dramatic, but that is how it should be I think for the ending of a man like him. Dumbledore did not kling to live at all cost like Voldemort, he was prepared to give his life for their cause. He is a greater wizard and man than anyone, especially Voldemort.
I have reread all the books in the last month and I am more convinced than ever that Snape is Dumbledore´s man through and through, just like Harry. I do not believe that Dumbledore would plead with Snape for his life. Snape had to kill him, he is the perfect double spy, Voldemort believes he is his man and now all his enemies believe he is Voldemort´s man too. Of course the way JK Rowling has set everything up it could also be the other way around and I am as mistaken in my faith in Snape as Dumbledore was. It is going to be a long wait for the final book.

[WebWarlock]

Do we have a tenative release date for Book 7 yet?

I also want to re-read all the books, but I want to do it closer to actual date so I can get a full on binge of Potter-mania going!

Besides I also think it would increase my enjoyment of the last book.

Warlock